Legislature(1999 - 2000)
02/29/2000 01:08 PM House TRA
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE TRANSPORTATION STANDING COMMITTEE February 29, 2000 1:08 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Representative Andrew Halcro, Chairman Representative Beverly Masek Representative Bill Hudson Representative John Cowdery Representative Allen Kemplen Representative Albert Kookesh MEMBERS ABSENT Representative Vic Kohring COMMITTEE CALENDAR HOUSE BILL NO. 319 "An Act providing for and relating to the issuance of state guaranteed transportation revenue anticipation bonds for the purpose of paying the cost of transportation projects that qualify for federal highway aid and the allocation of those bond proceeds; and providing for an effective date." - MOVED HB 319 OUT OF COMMITTEE HOUSE BILL NO. 59 "An Act relating to the motor fuel tax; and providing for an effective date." - SCHEDULED BUT NOT HEARD PREVIOUS ACTION BILL: HB 319 SHORT TITLE: TRANSPORTATION REVENUE ANTICIPATION BONDS Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action 1/26/00 2007 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS 1/26/00 2007 (H) TRA, FIN 1/26/00 2007 (H) FISCAL NOTE (REV) 1/26/00 2007 (H) ZERO FISCAL NOTE (DOT) 1/26/00 2007 (H) GOVERNOR'S TRANSMITTAL LETTER 2/17/00 (H) TRA AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 17 2/17/00 (H) <Bill Postponed to 2/22> 2/22/00 (H) TRA AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 17 2/22/00 (H) Heard & Held 2/22/00 (H) MINUTE(TRA) 2/29/00 (H) TRA AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 17 WITNESS REGISTER MARK RORICK 1055 Mendenhall Peninsula Road Juneau, Alaska 99801 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. AMI REIFENSTEIN PO Box 210375 Auke Bay, Alaska 99821-0375 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. DONALD OTIS, Mayor City of Haines PO Box 1049 Haines, Alaska 99827 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 319. ROBERT VENABLES, President Haines Chamber of Commerce 219 Main Street, Suite 1 Haines, Alaska 99827 POSITION STATEMENT: Deferred his comments to Donald Otis. VINCE HANSEN, Administrator City of Haines PO Box 1049 Haines, Alaska 99827 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 319. KEN RUSSO (Address not provided) Skagway, Alaska 99840 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. MIKE O'DANIEL (Address not provided) Skagway, Alaska 99840 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. JOHN MIELKE, Mayor City of Skagway PO Box 415 Skagway, Alaska 99840 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. BRIAN McNITT, Director Sitka Conservation Society PO Box 6533 Sitka, Alaska 99835 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. JERRY LAPP, Mayor Haines Borough PO Box 1209 Haines, Alaska 99827 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. GREG O'CLARY, Director Legislative & Governmental Affairs Marine Engineers Beneficial Association/District Number 1 AFL-CIO 229 4th Street Juneau, Alaska 99801 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. JAN WRENTMORE, Lobbyist City of Skagway PO Box 271 Skagway, Alaska 99840 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. BART HENDERSON (PH) (Address not provided) POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. NANCY WEBB, Assembly Member Fairbanks North Star Borough PO Box 71267 Fairbanks, Alaska 99707 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 319. JOSEPH L. PERKINS, Commissioner Department of Transportation & Public Facilities 3132 Channel Drive Juneau, Alaska 99801-7898 POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions regarding HB 319. ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 00-13, SIDE A Number 0001 CHAIRMAN ANDREW HALCRO called the House Transportation Standing Committee meeting to order at 1:08 p.m. Members present at the call to order were Representatives Halcro, Hudson, Cowdery, Kemplen, Kookesh and Kohring. Representative Masek arrived as the meeting was in progress. CHAIRMAN HALCRO announced that the committee will not be taking up HB 59 due to the current rise in the price of gasoline. He will put it on the "back burner." CHAIRMAN HALCRO announced that the committee will not be taking up HB 182. The sponsor has indicated that he doesn't have the votes to move the bill out of committee. Chairman Halcro will give the sponsor until Thursday, March 2, 2000 to get the votes. HB 319 - TRANSPORTATION REVENUE ANTICIPATION BONDS CHAIRMAN HALCRO announced the first order of business as House Bill 319, "An Act providing for and relating to the issuance of state guaranteed transportation revenue anticipation bonds for the purpose of paying the cost of transportation projects that qualify for federal highway aid and the allocation of those bond proceeds; and providing for an effective date." CHAIRMAN HALCRO indicated that the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities was very responsive in regards to the questions he submitted earlier. The answers are in the bill packet. CHAIRMAN HALCRO opened the meeting to public testimony. Number 0254 MARK RORICK came before the committee to testify. He is a 25-year resident of Juneau and is speaking for himself. He read the following into the record: Chairman Halcro, Representative Hudson, committee members. Thank you for the opportunity to testify on the Governor's accelerated transportation plan. I'm here to speak in favor of the $70 million in the bond proposal for the construction of two Alaska Marine Highway vessels to service Southeast Alaska. In particular, the one for the Lynn Canal route, which would run between Juneau, Haines and Skagway. These vessels will add needed capacity to the system, and do so on a convenient, everyday schedule. They can also be running in the near future, rather than in maybe--in 10 years or so as is the case with the road. The vessels are safe, reliable and have demonstrated their capabilities with, if I remember Bob Doll's comments correctly, over a thousand vessels of similar type in service worldwide. One has already been approved for Southeast Alaska. This vessel, along with the two in the Governor's bond proposal, would be interchangeable. This lessens maintenance costs and provides an ability to shift boats to where they are needed most when demand conditions change. The wide use of this type of vessel also means that should it not be needed at some time in the future there's a ready market should the state wish to sell it. This adding of capacity to an already existing system in Lynn Canal, using the recently upgraded ferry terminal in Auke Bay, also means that DOT won't have to go through a lengthy and contentious EIS [Environmental Impact Statement] process to provide the access and improvements Lynn Canal communities desire, as they would if they were going to build a new terminal 43 miles out-the-road in Berners Bay. After years of public discussions of these ferries and various transportation plans including the 1999 Southeast ferry plan, I applaud Commissioner Perkins and Governor Knowles for coming forward with an accelerated plan that with the approval of the voters would bring them online in an expeditious manner. One last point to remember. The construction of these vessels does not close off the pursuit of any other options and doesn't represent an irreversible decision on Juneau's future. I urge you to give this bond proposal to improve marine access in Lynn Canal a chance to work. Thank you. Number 0404 AMI REIFENSTEIN came before the committee to testify. She has been living in Juneau for twenty-five years. She doesn't have all the facts with her, but having grown up in Juneau she appreciates the uniqueness of not having a road that goes to other places. She strongly believes that Juneau should remain the way it is, with improved ferry access. Moreover, she wants to raise her family in Juneau, but a road might compromise safety by bringing in drifters and strangers. A road would change a lot of things; she will not raise her family here, if there is one. She said, "Juneau's a great community and if it changes a whole lot then, I think, a lot of people are gonna leave." Number 0588 DONALD OTIS, Mayor, City of Haines, testified via teleconference from Haines. Improved access is important to Juneau, Haines, Skagway and to the rest of the state. It's long overdue. Haines is united in their opposition to an east-side road. Haines supports a high-speed ferry to allow for access; it's very positive. A road, on the other hand, would be very negative to Haines, Skagway, and ultimately to Juneau and the rest of the state. He urged the committee members to move the bill forward. Number 0680 ROBERT VENABLES, President, Haines Chamber of Commerce, testified via teleconference from Haines. He deferred to Mr. Donald Otis' comments in the interest of time. Number 0705 VINCE HANSEN, Administrator, City of Haines, testified via teleconference from Haines. The time is now to act, he said. This proposal allows for movement forward in order to improve access. He also believes that using bond funds to help reduce the match requirement is a good idea. It reduces pressure on other spending, which affects everybody. A daily or regular ferry service, he said, will open up many opportunities for Haines. More people will plan activities with consistent service, and Haines sorely needs economic stimulus. The proposal also addresses long-standing concerns regarding access to the Interior and other parts of Southeast Alaska. Furthermore, the ferries will have a role with the road option, in that they will provide more flexibility. He urged the committee members to move the bill forward. Thank you. Number 0777 KEN RUSSO testified via teleconference from Skagway. He is speaking on his own behalf as a concerned citizen of Skagway. The great majority of the citizens of Skagway, he said, are in favor of ferry and marine access. This proposal seems to be in the best interest of the northern communities by improving access to Juneau and Lynn Canal. He urged the committee members to support the funding package. Thank you. Number 0860 MIKE O'DANIEL testified via teleconference from Skagway. He is a 52-year-resident of Skagway. He is representing himself, Skagway Air Service and Skagway Hardware, both of which are family companies. He feels that the fast ferries are a lesser evil to air carriers than the road. He announced, for the record, that he has always been staunchly opposed to the road. He is concerned about businesses in the transportation industry competing against transportation systems that are subsidized. Air carriers are part of the infrastructure of the economy of Skagway, which has suffered a blow in the last 10 to 15 years, and it's companies like his that have a retirement plan and health care program that take direct shocks when the economy suffers. He suggested that the committee members take a serious look at the subsidy part of this issue; the studies really didn't look at that specifically. He expressed his appreciation for being heard. Number 0974 CHAIRMAN HALCRO explained to Mr. O'Daniel that the topic of competition came up at the last committee hearing [2/22/00], at which time it was indicated that the cost of shipping cargo by air is prohibitive. It was also indicated that ferries provide a needed service of shipping cars. Although this committee is sensitive to the issue of competition between the government and the private sector, it was concluded that this is a case where it is warranted; it provides a needed service in Southeast Alaska. Number 1040 JOHN MIELKE, Mayor, City of Skagway, testified via teleconference from Skagway. The fast-ferry option, he said, moves in a direction that creates an avenue for better access for all of Southeast Alaska. Anything else would just cause delay, thereby affecting the rest of Southeast, not just the upper Lynn Canal and Juneau. It's important for everyone to note that access to Juneau is not just an avenue for recreation. This is a statewide issue. He also reminded the committee members that fast ferries were discussed in the Southeast Transportation Plan for 1986, at which time trial runs were made in upper Lynn Canal. Moreover, this does not eliminate a road in the big picture; it gives access sooner rather than later. He asked the committee members to pass the bill out of committee fully intact. Thank you. Number 1162 BRIAN McNITT, Director, Sitka Conservation Society [SCS], testified via teleconference from Sitka. SCS strongly supports the expanded use of ferries throughout Southeast Alaska. The ferries, he said, have always been an important transportation mode for freight, residents, and visitors, which are an important part of Sitka's economy. SCS feels that this type of ferry would increase service to Sitka by freeing up ferries at some point "down the road." SCS urged the committee members to pass the bill out of committee and continue to expand the ferry system for Southeast Alaska. Number 1251 REPRESENTATIVE JOHN COWDERY indicated that the proposal is more than just a ferry bill. There are projects in Fairbanks, Anchorage, Mat-Su Valley and Bethel. He asked Chairman Halcro whether anybody from those locations are online to testify. CHAIRMAN HALCRO replied no. REPRESENTATIVE BILL HUDSON pointed out that at the last committee hearing there was testimony from Fairbanks, Anchorage, Mat-Su Valley and even a few rural areas. [See House Transportation Committee minutes dates 2/22/00.] Number 1300 JERRY LAPP, Mayor, Haines Borough, testified via teleconference from Haines. The borough, he said, fully supports this legislation and would like to see it move forward. The committee members can see from the testimony that there is a lot of support. He thinks that this will improve the transportation needs of Southeast Alaska, which has been needed for a long time. Thank you. Number 1355 GREG O'CLARY, Director, Legislative & Governmental Affairs, Marine Engineers Beneficial Association/District Number 1 AFL-CIO, came before the committee to testify. He has been a resident of Alaska since 1950, primarily as a resident of Juneau. He has been involved in the Alaska Marine Highway System since 1963. He is aghast at the comments from a few individuals involved in the so-called "Juneau Access Committee." The system, he said, needs more vessels. Moreover, fast ferries are not a new idea. The idea has been around for years and years. He remembers when Representative [Bill] Hudson discussed a fast ferry during his first term in office. Furthermore, the Lynn Canal corridor has been studied enough; it has had a lot more money spent on it than any other project that hasn't come to fruition. As testimony from Haines and Skagway has indicated, there is no foreclosure on a potential road. The Governor, he said, made the right decision under the circumstances. He urged the committee members to pass the bill to the next committee of referral with the two fast ferries intact. Number 1528 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked Mr. O'Clary whether the marine engineers are working with the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities in relation to the performance of the high-speed ferry between Juneau and Sitka. He is concerned about safety in Sergius Narrows. MR. O'CLARY replied yes. The marine engineers have been involved. They were invited early on to participate. The same invitation was also offered to the "ship drivers." He further noted that the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities has been very forthcoming with information as well. Number 1657 JAN WRENTMORE, Lobbyist, City of Skagway, came before the committee to testify. Skagway feels that the fast ferries are an excellent solution to the bottleneck in northern Lynn Canal. The ferries will give the city great versatility in responding to traffic demands at different times of the year for various events. Moreover, fast ferries have been used all over the world. They are used in Scandinavia where the weather conditions are similar: narrow fjords, high winds, and big tides. If they can work there, she said, they can work in Alaska. Furthermore, by building three ferries of the same model, the state will save money on construction, design and maintenance costs because of interchangability. Skagway also supports Auke Bay as the departure point for passenger convenience. Departing from another location, she said, would require an EIS, thereby creating a further delay. The fast ferries are the short-term, expedient solution. Thank you. Number 1734 BART HENDERSON (PH) came before the committee to testify. He is the chairman of the Chamber of Commerce Marine Access Committee. The economic benefit in the off-season of daily ferry service between Haines, Skagway and Juneau represents a new opportunity, especially since Haines and Skagway suffer from a seasonal economy. It is seen as a means of directing tourism-related spending towards upper Lynn Canal and vice versa, which should not be overlooked. In addition, as the user-friendliness of the ferry system improves, more people will use it, which will help with the ongoing funding issues that the ferry system always faces. The Juneau-Skagway link has always been the most self-supporting part of the entire system, and those in the northern end believe that making this service more reliable, predictable and faster will create an even larger base of clientele. He said, "The old theory, if you build it they will come, I think, is never more appropriate than [ever] in this situation." He urged the committee members to support the bill. Number 1861 NANCY WEBB, Assembly Member, Fairbanks North Star Borough, testified via teleconference from Fairbanks. She is a member of the Infrastructure & Public Works Committee, which deals with transportation issues. The financing mechanism, she said, is interesting and worth pursuing, but she is hesitant about the process used to decide which projects should go on the ballot. She is not clear on what the people should expect to see on the ballot. She further said that the downtown project is the best type of project to be addressed by this type of funding because of its rapid development, otherwise it appears that it will take a long time to get funding on the STIP [Statewide Transportation Improvement Program]. The other assembly members would share that same feeling; however, she is not speaking in a way that reflects the whole assembly. The other two Fairbanks projects, as far as she can tell, would not move up in the timetable by placing them on the ballot. CHAIRMAN HALCRO called on Commissioner Joseph L. Perkins [Department of Transportation & Public Facilities] to address Ms. Webb's concerns. MS. WEBB asked Commissioner Perkins what affect this legislation would have on the University Avenue project and Illinois Street project in Fairbanks; it doesn't seem that they would move forward any faster. JOSEPH L. PERKINS, Commissioner, Department of Transportation & Public Facilities, came before the committee to answer Ms. Webb's questions. He explained that the department looked at projects that could be developed quickly. The projects that Ms. Webb referred can be developed within the next few years, and this legislation would gain time on construction by about three years for both projects. Number 2086 MS. WEBB asked Commissioner Perkins whether there would be a problem with the downtown project since there hasn't been a study done yet. She further asked Commissioner Perkins how he sees the regular process through local government approval fitting in with this project. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied the downtown project was presented by the mayor and various other individuals in Fairbanks. It would be done in conjunction with the city. It would probably be very similar to what was done to 5th and 6th Avenues in downtown Anchorage. It is not an enormous project to start; it mainly includes sidewalks, lighting facilities, and flower boxes. There would probably be some utility work, but he thinks that the project is quite deliverable in a short time once the city determines what they want. Number 2172 MS. WEBB asked Commissioner Perkins whether the money could be spent on improvements and enhancements for other types of projects. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied that the funding would be limited to projects listed in the legislation. CHAIRMAN HALCRO referred Ms. Webb to page 3, line 9, of the bill, and noted that the language reads, "downtown revitalization improvements," which gives the department the ability to decide on what amenities to fund. Number 2277 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked Commissioner Perkins whether the projects listed in the legislation are in addition to regularly funded projects. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied the legislation advances those projects forward; however, they are still part of the regular program. He said, If the regular program is $350 million a year, and our payment is $30 million, just as an example, then the regular program is going to be reduced to $320 million. So, they will be in the regular program, but they will be in for an equal amount of money each year for 15 years, assuming we sold the bonds. So, they would be in the program. REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said it seems that the legislation expands the transportation program appreciably. He asked Commissioner Perkins whether the legislature could anticipate accumulative projects in excess of $350 million a year. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied, yes, in the early years. The money would be spent up front. Number 2346 REPRESENTATIVE BEVERLY MASEK asked Commissioner Perkins whether the legislation would affect projects already slated for construction. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied there would be no impact in the first three years of the STIP, but beyond that, there would be some impact. He further said, But there'll be very little money paid back. Our payments, our big debt-service payments won't occur until probably three years into the program. You will be paying some interest, but it will be a minor impact. So, I would say the current STIP that you will look at for 01, 02 and 03 will have no impact. 04 is probably the year that gets charged the $30 million. Again, that's out of our illustrative program that we have just basically for information. It's not scheduled and it changes all around. So, that's the impact not on the three years of the STIP. CHAIRMAN HALCRO closed the meeting to public testimony. Number 2406 REPRESENTATIVE ALLEN KEMPLEN referred to the Glenn Highway-Gambell Street project in the legislation and noted that improvements in that part of town have always been fairly controversial. In 1991, he cited, AMTAS identified this area as special, in that it needed additional evaluation. Furthermore, when he contacted the neighborhood leaders they were not aware that this project was moving forward, which may result in some upset neighborhoods. TAPE 00-13, SIDE B Number 0001 COMMISSIONER PERKINS indicated that just about every project he does has some degree of controversy. He noted that a contractor is onboard to start the environmental work on the Glenn Highway-Gambell Street project, which will involve public hearings. The expected start date will give the department more than sufficient time to talk to the neighborhoods and get opinions from all those involved. Number 0057 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN indicated that he is questioning whether or not the voters in those communities would share that same sense of accommodation. He is not questioning the success of the department in pushing projects. Number 0088 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON made a motion to move HB 319 out of committee with individual recommendations and attached fiscal notes; he asked unanimous consent. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN objected to the motion in order to offer an amendment. REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON withdrew his motion. Number 0120 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN offered the following amendment [Amendment 1]: Page 2, line 29 delete "Gambell Street" Page 2, line 30 delete "to McCarrey Street" insert "Interchanges at Bragaw & Airport Heights" Page 2, line 31 change "65,000,000" to "25,000,000" REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN explained that the purpose of the amendment is to reflect safety concerns expressed by the neighborhoods. REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON indicated that he doesn't feel comfortable amending the legislation without a substantive understanding of the effects. CHAIRMAN HALCRO stated he would like to amend the legislation as well, but he doesn't want to turn it into a "Christmas tree." However, in deference to Representative Kemplen and the fact that this is a neighborhood issue, he will allow the commissioner to speak to the amendment and let the committee deal with it. Number 0260 COMMISSIONER PERKINS explained that Glenn Highway reduces to two lanes for about a mile then expands to three lanes at Gambell Street. There are traffic lights at the intersections, but the real problem is with congestion caused by the number of lanes. He doesn't think that the amendment would solve or even start to solve the problem. Number 0316 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN replied, certainly, there are issues of congestion in that part of town, but he questions whether the department has taken the best approach. He cited that a number of states are using computer and video technology to increase throughput by up to 20 percent in corridors. This amendment would allow for work to proceed for those interchanges where there is consensus, and would allow for a six-lane project through the normal capital improvement process. Number 0465 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked Commissioner Perkins whether the issues brought up by Representative Kemplen are part of the normal STIP. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied that the plan for the Glenn Highway for the last 25 years has been to include six lanes. The project in this legislation is the last piece. He asked, "Now, if this wasn't the plan, why did we do the piece that goes all the way out to Muldoon, and why did we do the piece down by Gambell?" This area involved is very built up, but it's not built up with neighborhoods; it's built up with businesses. He reiterated that this has always been part of the plan, for it doesn't make sense to go from three lanes to two lanes then back to three lanes. Number 0560 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN urged the committee members to be very cautious in supporting capital projects that are solely oriented towards movement of vehicles at the expense of adjacent neighborhoods. He pointed out that the "six-laning" of Glenn Highway split the Mountain View neighborhood, which resulted in a decline of property value to the point that it is one of the poorest neighborhoods in Anchorage and probably the state. These types of road improvements, he said, have significant influence on adjacent land use and the people who live there. This amendment would provide for a balance. It would allow for some of the needed improvements, and would ensure that the adjoining neighborhoods are protected. REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY said, You know when I first came to Alaska we had that road changed to about 3rd Avenue, I think. We had a north and south Mountain View then. To say that crime has been influenced by this freeway...I would think that if there's crime in the area the thing to do is let the people get through there in a hurry. If that's the case, to tie this in to anything like that...I can't agree on that. REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY called the question. CHAIRMAN HALCRO stated that he was very tempted to make a change to this legislation to include a project at the interchange of Lake Otis and Tudor, but he elected not to because of how the proposal is put together. He will not support the amendment, but he agrees with the concept. Number 0730 REPRESENTATIVE MASEK asked Commissioner Perkins whether there were public hearings when the highway was brought to six lanes. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied that he wasn't around during those days, but he thinks that the rules were the same. REPRESENTATIVE MASEK asked Commissioner Perkins how many public hearings will be held. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied he's not sure exactly, but there will be a "bunch." REPRESENTATIVE MASEK asked Commissioner Perkins whether the department will be working with AMATS in relation to this project in order to iron out any problems, should they arise. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied that this is a National Highway System project, but the department will nonetheless work with AMATS as well. REPRESENTATIVE MASEK asked Commissioner Perkins whether he assumes that there will be a lot of public input. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied both Representative Kemplen and the neighborhoods will have adequate opportunity to comment on the plans, which is true for every project. Number 0917 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked Commissioner Perkins how many miles are involved in this stretch of highway. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied he's not sure exactly, but it's no more than a mile. REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said, I'm being a little facetious now. But it's $65,000 for one mile, and I'm just looking for 50 miles, which I think I can do for $240 million. It seems to me that we ought to be able to make a deal here, somewhere. COMMISSIONER PERKINS replied the difference is, there are 60,000 cars a day that travel down the Glenn highway. A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Kemplen and Kookesh voted "yea." Representatives Hudson, Masek, Halcro and Cowdery voted "nay." The amendment failed by a vote of 2-4. Number 0983 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON made a motion to move HB 319 out of committee with individual recommendations and attached fiscal notes; he asked unanimous consent. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN objected to the motion. He is still concerned about the Glenn Highway-Gambell Street project, especially as it relates to the state's lack of skilled labor. He is concerned that the state is pushing too much work into the economy, which would result in an importation of labor from the Lower 48, especially when a more reasonable approach can be taken to ensure that only Alaskans are hired. He is also concerned about the expenses associated with operation and maintenance, especially since maintenance stations are being closed around the state. He hopes that these issues would be considered before the legislation leaves the purview of the House Transportation Committee. Number 1162 CHAIRMAN HALCRO replied that the commissioner has already testified that there are a sufficient number of contractors and workers interested in these projects. He further stated one thing that attracts him to this bond package is the fact that it doesn't build any new roads; it simply improves existing ones. He said, "As we all know, a lot of federal highway money can't be used to fix potholes or haul snow or repair sidewalks." This legislation is an innovative way to allow for improved transportation flow, improved amenities, and improved access. Number 1255 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN stated he doesn't see a fiscal note attached to the legislation. What is the actual cost? It's one thing to talk anecdotally; it's another thing to have hard numbers, especially before making a decision. Any business person, he said, who is serious about keeping a tight control on cost-structures always wants to know what is going to be the long-term obligation before incurring debt. Number 1321 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON stated that, according to previous testimony, the projects in this legislation would not "super heat" the economy. They would be spread over a number of years. Moreover, if there is a shortage of labor, it's probably because of the tremendous transportation boom down South, which may not be all that bad; it may result in additional training for Alaskans. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN maintained his objection to moving the bill out of committee. A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Hudson, Masek, Halcro, Cowdery and Kookesh voted "yea." Representative Kemplen voted "nay." By a vote of 5-1, HB 319 so moved from the House Transportation Standing Committee. ADJOURNMENT There being no further business before the committee, Chairman Halcro adjourned the House Transportation Standing Committee meeting at 2:25 p.m.
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